I have been collecting information from ACMO members, CCI members and the senior boys about CAFCOR, there are no rooms in condo industry for CAFCOR.

I recommend, incorporating as many as possible of the CCI-ACMO policy and procedures that you see fit to enact.

Just wondering - who are the senior boys from the industry?

Sorry ACMO Dude, but I don't understand the meaning of "there are no rooms in condo industry for CAFCOR".

CAFCOR looks out for the interests of unit Owners and "the industry" looks out for the interests of "the industry". I am not surprised that they have no room for an organization which strives to further the rights and interests of condominium unit Owners. In any event, CAFCOR has no interest in taking up residence in one of those rooms. I'm told on occasion by those in "the industry" to give them a chance to change. Well, they've had 25 or 30 years and I suspect, saddly, that it is a classic tale of the leopard not being able to change its spots.

As for the "standard management contract", "standard" is the operative word. It has been "the industry standard" to take as much as it can for as little as possible and they have gotten away with it for a very long time now. Fortunately though, "that standard" is changing with "self-management" and "Independent Property Managers", one Corporation at a time.

Sorry, Yvon, but CAFCOR is part of the condominium industry. The organization assists the people it is named for, namely the owners, just like ACMO helps its members (property managers.) Seeing that there is not other group that is dedicated to seeing things from the point of view of owners, I would argue that there is plenty of "room" for CAFCOR in the industry and I wonder why this "ACMO Dude" seems to be so negative about CAFCOR? (Although I do understand that CAFCOR will not turn away anyone in the condominium industry who require assistance unlike other organizations like ACMO who only care about their own interest group.)

Acmo Dude sounds like an Acmo Dud! Thank goodness we have intelligent people proactive enough to stick their necks out and do something to solve our own problems. Would you want the likes of A.D. managing your condo?

Yvon wrote:
"As for the "standard management contract", "standard" is the operative word. It has been "the industry standard" to take as much as it can for as little as possible and they have gotten away with it for a very long time now. Fortunately though, "that standard" is changing with "self-management" and "Independent Property Managers", one Corporation at a time."


It can't be surprising that "the industry" strives to maximize profits. That's nowadays the key objective of every business.

As for "self-management", I think it is a very desirable direction. Only a few condominiums, however, will be able to follow such a path and they will surely need a lot of support, especially at the beginning.

Mark

Hello Mark,

But is taking advantage of your clients' (Board's) ignorance by simply not fulfilling your end of an Agreement an acceptable way of doing business? Is that what you mean by:"It can't be surprising that "the industry" strives to maximize profits. That's nowadays the key objective of every business"? If so Mark, then all the more reason why unit Owners must reclaim control of their Corporations.

If a PMC is contracted to manage a condominium Corporation, does that PMC not owe a duty to the Corporation to protect unit Owner interests as an "Agent of the Corporation?

As for "self-management", this most certainly can apply to smaller Corporations but in larger, more complex condominium Communities, this would certainly not be an option. Enter the "Independent Property Manager" who answers directly to a competent and well informed Board of Directors, who, in turn, answers to those who contribute the uttermost farthing.

Yvon wrote:
If a PMC is contracted to manage a condominium Corporation, does that PMC not owe a duty to the Corporation to protect unit Owner interests as an "Agent of the Corporation?

I would say so.

Yvon wrote:
As for "self-management", this most certainly can apply to smaller Corporations but in larger, more complex condominium Communities, this would certainly not be an option. Enter the "Independent Property Manager" who answers directly to a competent and well informed Board of Directors, who, in turn, answers to those who contribute the uttermost farthing.

I would aso concur. Self-management is great but is not always practical for every situtation. Also, as a property manager gains expererience, he/se develops a list of contractors who can be hired to do many different jobs. This list may or may not be of benefit to the organization. So would any contacts provided by owners in the complex, as well as a list of contractors that have been of a benefit to the condominium in the past.

Why would anyone not want CAFCOR within the industry. Isn't the industry suppose to assist homeowners within the Corporation that pay's for contractors, PMC's fees?

It's the standard that needs to be address....it's not a boys/girls club industry. You are speaking about individuals asset that homeowners have bought not to be riped off, managers are paid good salary to advise but where is the accountability from ACMO and CCI over the years, who does the owner turn to THE INDUSTRY. There is no support unless you have the money to hire, lawyers.

I don't understand your statement. Would you please elaborate on this!

Hello Anna,

You are quite correct and CAFCOR exists because of this "lack of accountability" within "the industry".

I see a difference in terminology. To me, "the industry" is all those who want to provide some type of goods or service to us unit Owners in exchange for our money. We, on the other hand, are the ones who pay all of the bills.

The problem lies in the fact that there is absolutely no value for money. Would you pay for a pair of shoes with no soles in them? Would you buy a car with no engine? Of course you wouldn't but our Corporations do it all the time. We sign contracts with service providers who do not provide the services outlined in their contracts. (no soles in the shoes we're paying for)

If for instance, the Board of your Corporation decided to turn all of their authority and bank accounts over to the groundskeeping contractor, the cleaning contractor, the maintenance contractor or any other contractor, I would expect that the unit Owners would cause heads to roll yet Boards turn their authority and the Corporation's bank accounts over to contractors all of the time. The only difference is that instead of the groundskeeping contractor, it is the property management contractor.

There is a difference between "the industry" and condominium Communities. CAFCOR helps condominium communities while "the industry" helps themselves - to our wallets.

Yvon wrote:
There is a difference between "the industry" and condominium Communities. CAFCOR helps condominium communities while "the industry" helps themselves - to our wallets.

Yvon, a condominium community has many stakeholders. They include the owners, the Board, the Government (provincially as they deal with the "laws" that condominiums are supposed run under as well as the municpal Governments who collect the property taxes from condos), Auditors, Managers, Management Companies, Engineers, etc. So, in essence the community is one part of the industry.

Although I respect your opinions Wotan, I draw a clear line between "the industry" and "our communities". Always have, always will! The interests of unit Owners is first and foremost with me and quite frankly, I'm not interested in the interests of "the industry". They have proven, time and time again, that they are quite capable of looking after themselves - always at the expense of unit Owners.

Yvon, I do agree that owners have been mistreated by the rest of the industry, but I still disagree with trying to state that owners are not part of the condominium industry as we (the owners) provide the financing for the condominium industry. As long as the owners provide the rest of the condominium industry with money, we are part (although a small part) of the industry, at least from a business point of view.